D3D11-Renderer für Gothic 2 (alpha) #5

**Lehona** · 05.01.2015 11:49

Ohne die Scripte zu sehen, kann man da wenig zu sagen

Aber eigentlich sollte der D3D11-Renderer da wenig mit zu tun haben - merkwürdig.

**Degenerated** · 05.01.2015 12:40

Zitat von Lehona

Ohne die Scripte zu sehen, kann man da wenig zu sagen

Aber eigentlich sollte der D3D11-Renderer da wenig mit zu tun haben - merkwürdig.

Es kann sein, dass dort eine andere Routine benutzt wird um das VOB aus der Welt zu nehmen, und mein Renderer es nicht so ganz mitbekommt, dass da etwas gelöscht wurde. Ich kann mir das aber mal anschauen wenn ich Zeit dafür finde

**joey1990** · 05.01.2015 13:10

was denkst du wann eine weitere version fertig sein wird

**Lehona** · 05.01.2015 14:28

Zitat von Degenerated

Es kann sein, dass dort eine andere Routine benutzt wird um das VOB aus der Welt zu nehmen, und mein Renderer es nicht so ganz mitbekommt, dass da etwas gelöscht wurde. Ich kann mir das aber mal anschauen wenn ich Zeit dafür finde

Das kann natürlich sein, auch wenn es mich wundern würde. Schließlich sollte das Item dann ja trotzdem im Inventar auftauchen?
Das ist vermutlich die Grundlage dieses Features und verwendet sogar zum Entfernen eine External - d.h. eine native Funktion in den Scripten. Die sollten schon intakt bleiben

**Degenerated** · 05.01.2015 14:30

Zitat von Lehona

Das kann natürlich sein, auch wenn es mich wundern würde. Schließlich sollte das Item dann ja trotzdem im Inventar auftauchen?

Wie meinst du das nun? Das Vob, was man in der Welt von einem Item hat, ist ein anderes als das, was später im Inventar zu sehen ist.
Gothic rendert jede einzelne Zelle des Inventars als eine eigene Welt, in der immer nur eine Kamera und ein Vob ist.
Beides wird für jede Zelle neu erstellt und mit dem Model gefüttert, was am Item eben dran hängt.

Wenn du nun also etwas aus der Welt aufsammelst, wird das Vob aus der Welt gelöscht und der Item-Code in dein Inventar gepackt.
Und ich denke da könnte es schief laufen.

**Jurigag** · 05.01.2015 21:09

Okay. Its seems that L'Hiver causing totally random crashes when loading/starting a game. Sometimes its starts/loads without any problem, sometimes it doesnt and i cant really find why, when i change a name of ddraw.dll then no problem.

Only vurts loading without any problem.

It seems that some disabled vdf in data caused a crash when starting a game.......

Now its weird, when i start a new game with lhiver its loads fine, when i load save then its also fine. But when i load a save game just crash :O

Also i found that some textures dont load on vurts or they load as specular cuz they try to reflect the sun:

Without dx11 : http://imagizer.imageshack.us/a/img540/2130/vOL28m.png
With dx11 : http://imageshack.com/a/img538/1209/bYbEvU.png

Also i add some screens with sun to https://imageshack.us/a/Mtbz/1

Also i made some vanilla screens with no texture mod: https://imageshack.us/a/KMqz/1

**Fhaeil** · 06.01.2015 11:13

Finally, X2.1 works with G2MDK. Since V7 or 9 I was getting draw.dll errors. Now Gothic looks fantastic.
I hope you will increase shadow draw distance. Also I hope that controlling camera after F6 with mouse will be possible soon (now it works as the game was in window).
Is there a way to force AA, AF and V-Sync from driver control panel?

**Degenerated** · 06.01.2015 12:35

Zitat von Jurigag

Okay. Its seems that L'Hiver causing totally random crashes when loading/starting a game. Sometimes its starts/loads without any problem, sometimes it doesnt and i cant really find why, when i change a name of ddraw.dll then no problem.

Only vurts loading without any problem.

It seems that some disabled vdf in data caused a crash when starting a game.......

Now its weird, when i start a new game with lhiver its loads fine, when i load save then its also fine. But when i load a save game just crash :O

Also i found that some textures dont load on vurts or they load as specular cuz they try to reflect the sun:

Without dx11 : http://imagizer.imageshack.us/a/img540/2130/vOL28m.png
With dx11 : http://imageshack.com/a/img538/1209/bYbEvU.png

Also i add some screens with sun to https://imageshack.us/a/Mtbz/1

Also i made some vanilla screens with no texture mod: https://imageshack.us/a/KMqz/1

Your screenshots look very nice

I will look into these problems with lhiver.
Those strange looking clouds are a problem with how I render the worldmesh. I thought that the world-mesh can't use alphablending at all and uses only the alpha test, and thus everything uses alphatest at most. That is true for the original Gothic 2 at least. I'll write it onto my todo list.

Zitat von Fhaeil

Finally, X2.1 works with G2MDK. Since V7 or 9 I was getting draw.dll errors. Now Gothic looks fantastic.
I hope you will increase shadow draw distance. Also I hope that controlling camera after F6 with mouse will be possible soon (now it works as the game was in window).
Is there a way to force AA, AF and V-Sync from driver control panel?

You mean after pressing F11? You can press ESC twice to get the mouse ingame again.

Forcing AA using the driver would be a bad idea, because I'm using Deferred Rendering and HDR, and it's hard to make MSAA working with that. It most certainly wont work. I have to do some modifications to my rendering-engine for AA, and I think I just go for SMAA because it looks good and is very simple.

AF is locked at 16x and sure, I can implement V-Sync if you want that.

**warstrike** · 06.01.2015 12:36

Hello there. Since there are some posts in english i thought of posting myself . I wanted to ask if the game is playable with DX11 because i get many bugs.I have system pack installed,and no other mods/patches. Might that be the problem?

**Milky-Way** · 06.01.2015 12:46

Welcome in the editing section of the WoG

Posting in English is not a problem at all (at least in the editing section) and even preferred to using something like google translate

, many people here are fluent in English and some (including me) are willing to offer translations if need be. (Probably not necessary here since Degenerated seems comfortable writing in English.)

Zitat von warstrike

Hello there. Since there are some posts in english i thought of posting myself . I wanted to ask if the game is playable with DX11 because i get many bugs.I have system pack installed,and no other mods/patches. Might that be the problem?

Which version are you using? The project was restarted to take full advantage of the experience gained from the first series of releases (1 to 18) and started with low version numbers again.
The new version appears to be have more bugs than the old version at the moment. Neither version is a stable or final release, however, so if you really just want to play without problems, you should probably not use them. If you do use the newest version, reporting the bugs you encounter in this thread will help development. For the older version, bugfixes are rather unlikely now, from what I understand.

**Degenerated** · 06.01.2015 12:46

Zitat von warstrike

Hello there. Since there are some posts in english i thought of posting myself . I wanted to ask if the game is playable with DX11 because i get many bugs.I have system pack installed,and no other mods/patches. Might that be the problem?

The systempack only causes a lower performance on all versions before X1. What version are you using, and what kinds of Bugs do you mean?

If you aren't using the one which came with the launcher, then you are playing with a version that is only meant for testing, because it is still heavily under development.

**Fhaeil** · 06.01.2015 14:16

Zitat von Degenerated

You mean after pressing F11? You can press ESC twice to get the mouse ingame again.

No, I mean B Marvin B and F6 to control camera (for machinima). With DX11 I can't control camera using mouse, only via keybord (as the game was in windows, but it's not). Also with this mod we can't go to window mode by pressing F3 in marvin mode.

Zitat von Degenerated

Forcing AA using the driver would be a bad idea, because I'm using Deferred Rendering and HDR, and it's hard to make MSAA working with that. It most certainly wont work. I have to do some modifications to my rendering-engine for AA, and I think I just go for SMAA because it looks good and is very simple.

MSAA not needed, prefere SSAA, the best, true AA. SMAA is good when you don't have power for at least MSAAx4 (but in for example Crysis 3, MSAAx4 looks way worse than SMAA on ultra).

Zitat von Degenerated

AF is locked at 16x and sure, I can implement V-Sync if you want that.

Indeed, AF is working. About V-Sync, I actually want Adaptive V-Sync, no input lag, no tearing. And I guess it can be turned on only from nvidia control panel (but normal V-sync is better than nothing).

And thank you for info about F11, I didn't know about it. And I noticed the same, as it was on previous builds. Why, when I increase shadow draw distnace, quality of shadows getting worse, and when I decrease draw distance, quality is better, just like in Skyrim. Will we be able to have max quality and long shadow draw distance?

About English, it would be great, if posts with changelog and to do will be translated to english. But I guess all will just download the newest version and try it on their PCs.

**warstrike** · 06.01.2015 17:28

Zitat von Degenerated

The systempack only causes a lower performance on all versions before X1. What version are you using, and what kinds of Bugs do you mean?

If you aren't using the one which came with the launcher, then you are playing with a version that is only meant for testing, because it is still heavily under development.

Yup ,it seems that i was playing the testing version.Looks cool though.So far ,this is the best improvement for Gothic 2 that i've ever played in the past 12 years

**Degenerated** · 06.01.2015 22:38

Mal eine Frage an die etwas Modder-Erfahreneren hier: Wie genau stellt man im Spacer ein, wenn eine Textur, wie z.B. von einem Baum, einen Alpha-Test machen soll? Also, dass ab einem bestimmten Alpha-Wert einfach alles weggeschnitten wird.

Ich habe zwar in der zCMaterial-Klasse etwas gefunden, was eigentlich genau das machen soll, allerdings scheint das zuverlässig zu sein.
Wird das vielleicht in der Textur eingestellt, statt im Material und ich muss die Textur erst laden bevor ich das abfragen kann?

No, I mean B Marvin B and F6 to control camera (for machinima). With DX11 I can't control camera using mouse, only via keybord (as the game was in windows, but it's not). Also with this mod we can't go to window mode by pressing F3 in marvin mode.

Oh, I didn't even know that the free cam is supposed to have mouse control. Never worked for me I think. I will look into that though.

You can go to windowed-mode by pressing ALT+ENTER, as in many DirectX-Games.

MSAA not needed, prefere SSAA, the best, true AA. SMAA is good when you don't have power for at least MSAAx4 (but in for example Crysis 3, MSAAx4 looks way worse than SMAA on ultra).

SSAA is easier to implement, but I will do SMAA first, as you can easily force SSAA through the driver nowdays I think?

And thank you for info about F11, I didn't know about it. And I noticed the same, as it was on previous builds. Why, when I increase shadow draw distnace, quality of shadows getting worse, and when I decrease draw distance, quality is better, just like in Skyrim. Will we be able to have max quality and long shadow draw distance?

Thats mostly because I'm using a very simple algorithm for shadowing at the moment. The problem lays at how you draw shadowmaps in 3d-games.
Think of it as putting a second camera up into the sky where the sun is and rendering the sceneto another buffer, texture, image or whatever you want to call it. That image is mostly of resolutions like 1024x1024 or 2048x2048 or something higher.

The point is: It stores the needed depth-values from the perspective of the sun into the pixels.
So what happens when you zoom out in a 3D-Game? The objects in the back of the scene are getting smaller, and use less pixels on your screen.
If you upscale that, which is what the shadow-draw-distance is basically doing, you get blocky artifacts.

There are algorithms which reduce this issue, like using multiple shadowmaps for different draw distances to get better resolution at the front.
I'm planning on implementing such an algorithm, so that will help

About English, it would be great, if posts with changelog and to do will be translated to english. But I guess all will just download the newest version and try it on their PCs.

Sure, I can do that.

Zitat von warstrike

Yup ,it seems that i was playing the testing version.Looks cool though.So far ,this is the best improvement for Gothic 2 that i've ever played in the past 12 years

Thanks

**virus-found** · 07.01.2015 02:04

Hi. The only problem I have with version X2.1 is that some objects are invisible. E.g. in Xardas Tower there are invisible potions, tables, chimney (on which the secret button resides), portcullis, candles on the floor, etc. I wonder if it's just not done yet in this version, or is it something in my Gothic.ini?

Anyway, views and landscapes are just breathtaking! And the gameplay is smooth and pleasant. Thank you for your really great efforts.

**Fhaeil** · 07.01.2015 16:43

Alt+tab is working with this mod, but not with normal game...

Zitat von Degenerated

SSAA is easier to implement, but I will do SMAA first, as you can easily force SSAA through the driver nowdays I think?

Well, how? NVidia doesn't have this option in control panel. Only MSAA, CSAA and transparency AA.
Here is link to exe, which can turn on SSAA. It kills framerate very good, but it doesn't work, on clear and with DX11. DSR also doesn't work (program stopped responding).

So I have to wait for Your implementation.

**Rothinsky** · 07.01.2015 18:10

Zitat von Fhaeil

Well, how? NVidia doesn't have this option in control panel. Only MSAA, CSAA and transparency AA.
Here is link to exe, which can turn on SSAA. It kills framerate very good, but it doesn't work, on clear and with DX11. DSR also doesn't work (program stopped responding).

So I have to wait for Your implementation.

You could use the tool Nvidia Inspector to enable SSAA in any specific game. Also SSAA natively needs a very strong system to work.

On the other hand I don´t really think Gothic needs such an option because the aliasing-effects are normally not as visible in my opinion.

**Unschuldsengel** · 07.01.2015 20:00

Erstmal möchte ich ein einfaches "Wow" loswerden. Hätte nicht gedacht, dass G2 noch so aufhübschen kann. Meinen großen Respekt Degenerated und weiterhin viel Spaß und Erfolg bei deiner Bastelarbeit.

Da ich mir mal ingame ein Bild machen wollte, habe ich direkt G2 wieder rausgekramt und frisch installiert. Allerdings gibt's bei mir so einige Probleme.
Ich habe den Launcher ausm Startpost runtergeladen in den System-Ordner extrahiert. Wenn ich den starte, will er ein Update auf V21 machen, was ich bejahe und dann kommt kurz vor Downloadende folgende Meldung:

[Bild: attachment.php?attachmentid=42106&d=1420660614&thumb=1]

In den Details steht folgendes:

Spoiler:

Ich kann null damit anfangen. Scheint nen Problem mit .NET Framework zu sein. Vielleicht wisst ihr voran es hängt.

Wenn ich die Update-Meldung verneine, was ja eigentlich Quatsch ist, öffnet sich der Launcher ganz normal. Sobald ich aber auf Start klicke kommt die gleiche Meldung wieder und es bricht ab.

**Degenerated** · 07.01.2015 20:11

Zitat von Fhaeil

Alt+tab is working with this mod, but not with normal game...

Well, how? NVidia doesn't have this option in control panel. Only MSAA, CSAA and transparency AA.
Here is link to exe, which can turn on SSAA. It kills framerate very good, but it doesn't work, on clear and with DX11. DSR also doesn't work (program stopped responding).

So I have to wait for Your implementation.

DSR is basically the same as SSAA, so I meant that. Both render the full scene at a higher resolution and scale them down afterwards.

Don't know about Alt-Tab in the original. Is it bad that it is working in the mod?

Zitat von virus-found

Hi. The only problem I have with version X2.1 is that some objects are invisible. E.g. in Xardas Tower there are invisible potions, tables, chimney (on which the secret button resides), portcullis, candles on the floor, etc. I wonder if it's just not done yet in this version, or is it something in my Gothic.ini?

Anyway, views and landscapes are just breathtaking! And the gameplay is smooth and pleasant. Thank you for your really great efforts.

Well, thanks!

The missining objects have nothing to do with your Gothic.ini. I have them too, so the problem is somewhere in my code. Not sure where, though, but I will get there.

Zitat von Unschuldsengel

Erstmal möchte ich ein einfaches "Wow" loswerden. Hätte nicht gedacht, dass G2 noch so aufhübschen kann. Meinen großen Respekt Degenerated und weiterhin viel Spaß und Erfolg bei deiner Bastelarbeit.

Da ich mir mal ingame ein Bild machen wollte, habe ich direkt G2 wieder rausgekramt und frisch installiert. Allerdings gibt's bei mir so einige Probleme.
Ich habe den Launcher ausm Startpost runtergeladen in den System-Ordner extrahiert. Wenn ich den starte, will er ein Update auf V21 machen, was ich bejahe und dann kommt kurz vor Downloadende folgende Meldung:

[Bild: attachment.php?attachmentid=42106&d=1420660614&thumb=1]

In den Details steht folgendes:

Spoiler:

Ich kann null damit anfangen, aber vielleicht wisst ihr voran es hängt.

Wenn ich die Update-Meldung verneine, was ja eigentlich Quatsch ist, öffnet sich der Launcher ganz normal. Sobald ich aber auf Start klicke kommt die gleiche Meldung wieder und es bricht ab.

Wenn du das wirklich in den System-Ordner extrahiert hast wüsste ich nicht, warum das nicht klappen sollte.

Du solltest auf jeden Fall G3D3D11Launcher.exe und G2D3D11Updater.exe und eine ähnlich benannte Config im Ordner haben, vielleicht hast du eine der Dateien vergessen? (Fehlermeldung sagt "kann datei nicht finden", aber leider nicht welche)

Außerdem sollte der startknopf des Launchers nur ganz normal die Gothic2.exe starten, also die sollte wohl im selben Ordner sein oder?

**Fhaeil** · 07.01.2015 20:17

Zitat von Rothinsky

You could use the tool Nvidia Inspector to enable SSAA in any specific game.

Hmmm, I agree. I missed it before. But it also doesn't work with DX11.

@up
Yeah, I know that DSR - downsampling = supersampling.

D3D11-Renderer für Gothic 2 (alpha) #5

Themen-Optionen

Berechtigungen