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Rookie
Just Started Gothic 3, frustrated
Hi there,
The other day I was looking for a fun RPG to play, so went and got Risen and Gothic 3. I just finished playing Risen, which was alright, and have moved on to Gothic 3. After installing all of the updates and the community patch (1.73?) I turned on Alternate Balancing and Alternate Combat AI and started a game on Hard.
The game starts, and the first tip tells me to press Space to draw my sword, so I do. It then tells me to left click to hit things and hold right click to parry.
To make a long story short, the enemies seem to be able to do all sorts of neat tricks, while my own attacks and parries do not always work. I really want to think that this game is more than a waste of several gigabytes on my hard drive, but the game seems determined to make me dislike it.
Since this forum is presumably populated by people who think Gothic is the best game series ever, I thought I would come here and ask you folks to tell me why and how you played this game beyond the first fifteen seconds, and what I can do to find enjoyment in this frustrating software.
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24.08.2010 22:26
#2
I wish I could help you but I hate G3.
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Try on easy or medium difficulty if you can not kill the orcs that do "neat" tricks.
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 Zitat von Flambo
Hi there,
The other day I was looking for a fun RPG to play, so went and got Risen and Gothic 3. I just finished playing Risen, which was alright, and have moved on to Gothic 3. After installing all of the updates and the community patch (1.73?) I turned on Alternate Balancing and Alternate Combat AI and started a game on Hard.
The game starts, and the first tip tells me to press Space to draw my sword, so I do. It then tells me to left click to hit things and hold right click to parry.
To make a long story short, the enemies seem to be able to do all sorts of neat tricks, while my own attacks and parries do not always work. I really want to think that this game is more than a waste of several gigabytes on my hard drive, but the game seems determined to make me dislike it.
Since this forum is presumably populated by people who think Gothic is the best game series ever, I thought I would come here and ask you folks to tell me why and how you played this game beyond the first fifteen seconds, and what I can do to find enjoyment in this frustrating software.
Only brawn, no brain I see? Maybe neiter?
You said you set the game on hard. A bit later you complain that the game is to hard. Maybe you should reduce difficulty. Normal is what offers the best experience, but if you find that to hard also, set to easy.
You can change it whenever you like in options.
Brief on combat system, although a litle experimenting should be enough to understand how it works:
left click - normal attack
hold left mouse button - strong attack
right click - fast attack
hold right mouse button - block
block + hold left mouse button - stab
(if two hander) block + left click - a 360 degree attack
Not that hard I'd say.
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Rookie
 Zitat von RobinHood 13.
Only brawn, no brain I see? Maybe neiter?
You said you set the game on hard. A bit later you complain that the game is to hard. Maybe you should reduce difficulty. Normal is what offers the best experience, but if you find that to hard also, set to easy.
You can change it whenever you like in options.
Brief on combat system, although a litle experimenting should be enough to understand how it works:
left click - normal attack
hold left mouse button - strong attack
right click - fast attack
hold right mouse button - block
block + hold left mouse button - stab
(if two hander) block + left click - a 360 degree attack
Not that hard I'd say.
I agree, it wasn't very hard at all to figure those things out. Having already figured those things out, I came to this forum seeking useful advice, rather than snide, unhelpful jabs at my character. Good effort though!
After making a save for myself (this game evidently expects a new player who dies to restart the game client to try again) I experimented through several deaths, finally running away from the action into the field to practice swings. When I tried to apply my new knowledge I found that the fast swings weren't very fast - the enemies did a really good job of getting hit, and then hitting me back before I had recovered enough to parry. Even when I was parrying, the enemies would often hit me anyway. It was pretty clear that the slow, obvious overhead swings were unparryable, but even the small quick swings would often magically go unparried. Best of all, whenever it felt as though I was getting the hang of things, several Scouts would come out of nowhere to single me out specifically, ignoring other opponents even if I ran clear out of town.
I appreciate the suggestion to alter difficulty. I tend to play games on hard because they just don't make 'em like they used to - most games today aren't very difficult even on the highest setting. Every now and again there is a game that just isn't meant to be played on Hard at all. Are you saying Gothic 3 is one of those? Unless Hard means that the AI cheats, I'd really rather keep it there.
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*Disable the alternative AI. The enemies will not parry anymore and fight really crappy.
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The block lasts 2,5 sec(?), you get hit after that.
Mate, it is clear you are not good enough to play on hard. You do not know how to time attacks, you do not know how to read your enemy, you are a beginer. Start on easy or medium and learn the game. Leave your "allways on hard" pride aside because you are simply not good enough for hard dif. , most likely you are not good enough for medium either. Good luck!
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Okay, so Hard is indeed hard at the beginning. But at this point it isn't about the difficulty, it's about how well and how efficiently you can fight. I'll try to outline how it should go at the beginning.
First off, at the beginning you're likely too weak to take on two orcs at once. In the initial battle, there is no orc to attack you at first, so find one of the orcs already being attacked by one of your friends and hit it from behind with power attacks until it falls.
Once you get attacked make sure you are only being attacked by one orc. Just run away from them if there are several, run around the town, lose them and find a single opponent. Since you have a one-handed weapon, and the orcs have no shields, you can use the thrust attack (long left click while in blocking stance). Use it when the enemy has just taken a swing and is vulnerable; you can, for example, dodge an overhead attack and then use the thrust attack. This will leave the orc stunned; follow up with a power attack quickly. This should deal him quite a lot of damage (relatively). Repeat until the orc is dead. You can also use quick swings to interrupt slower swings. If you don't think you have the time to execute a thrust attack, then try a normal (single left-click) attack when the orc is vulnerable.
This should get you through the first fight. Be sure to kill the leader somehow! As for the future - if you want an easy time in melee, you should eventually learn dual wielding. It takes a high Hunting and Strength, but it really is the best combat style - you have a very fast thrust attack and a power attack that can get through any parries, except for shields, while dealing a ton of damage. Next easiest is sword+shield; two-handers are the hardest to use. If you really want to have a very easy time, you can train to be a mage, but it is so much easier than melee that it's almost gamebreaking.
There really is nothing on Medium that can't be solved on Hard - all that differs is that enemies take longer to kill and one more person can attack you in melee at once. However, until very late in the game you are unlikely to be even able to take down two at once. And of course, they deal more damage, so you'll have to reload a bit more often if you screw up against animals.
Oh yes, about animals. They are the most dangerous opponents in G3 in single combat. They get through blocks and attack much more ferociously than humanoids. In the early game, wolves are particularly dangerous; you should consider training in archery (or super easy magic) while luring them one at a time if you want to take them down, or just bring a companion along (you have a rebel and a mercenary to choose from even in the coastal area). Boars are easier, just normal-attack them when you think they are about to attack, but haven't attacked yet. You'll learn to anticipate this. Then back off a little and do it again.
Also, don't listen to Maladiq. If you are complaining that games just aren't hard enough anymore, then you won't enjoy G3 without alternative balancing, at all.
Hope I helped. Don't give up - this game has a worse reputation than it deserves, really.
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 Zitat von Maladiq
*Disable the alternative AI. The enemies will not parry anymore and fight really crappy.
Then where's the challenge in that?
Well IMHO it depends on how well you fight, and how well Gothic III runs, I remember I had a really sh*t PC and Gothic III lagged alot and I couldn't even hit the Orcs but they could hit me alot of times in which I couldn't fight back :/, I was forced to play on medium(difficultly), as for the actual fighting just parry alot lol that's what I do in the beginning, lator in the game just attack them and you'll drop them instantly .
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first play gothic 1 and gothic 2 ,then gothic 3 !
oh and if you can`t play it on hard ,why don`t you try on easy??
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 Zitat von Flambo
I agree, it wasn't very hard at all to figure those things out. Having already figured those things out, I came to this forum seeking useful advice, rather than snide, unhelpful jabs at my character. Good effort though!
Well, in your post it seemed you didn't do these things.
I didn't try to be mean, only encourage you to try controls/change_difficulty before complaining.
The AI can be quite good sometimes in timing, but can also be predictable.
I'd say it's a bit stupid to complain about it being to hard, while insisting on having the game on hard.
On hard, enemies dmg more and have more hp, and opposite for easy.
These numbers are balanced for normal, and that's why normal offers the best play experience.
Another aspect (with alternative ai), is that more than one enemy can attack you at once. On easy only 1 can, 2 on medium and 3 on hard. More could still surround you though and who hits could change at any moment.
You should try G2, especially with addon. It's their best product. There there's no difficulty, but the addon night of the raven is quite hard (if you haven't played G2 before which is not as difficult).
I remember I read a negative review about G2 (not with addon). The reviewer's complaint was that it was way to hard, and apparently mage was impossible. I'll have to say I found G2 way to easy after I learned how to develop a character handling combat properly.
Gothic + Risen games don't hold your hands. You may encounter enemies that are far beyond you skills. In that case back away and come back later. They also don't show an arrow over your head, pointing you in the right direction. Neither would click bashing an enemy to death work very well.
G2 is definitely the best in content. Lots of sidequests, and also new quests/events near end. A large dense city, Khorinis, which easily beats the one in Risen and those in G3. Less linearity between the different guilds (best replay value).
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What if he has a Geforce? We can't run G1 or G2 on those right now.
Back to the topic, in the first fight - you don't die even though you automatically kill orcs. After getting up, you should drink a potion of health so that you get back at least 50% of your health. Oh, and I think that your first combat with humanoids in Risen is much more difficult than G3 because in that case, you really have to be careful about parrying and dodging and attacking even on the easy setting and though you don't die, the chappie you fought will help himself to much more than his fair share of your gold.
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Back to the topic, in the first fight - you don't die even though you automatically kill orcs.
Not on hard. There, you get killed.
Oh, and I think that your first combat with humanoids in Risen is much more difficult than G3
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Funny. First time I fought against a humanoid, it was in the bandit camp. I had nothing but a sword and a shield on me, and I had to fight Clay. And here's the funny part, I didn't lose. I immediately figured out what the best tactics are for defeating him, just like that. After that, I went on to (without any training or better equipment) defeat all the arena fighters including Craig and Domingo - my toughest fight was against a bog body, who killed me the first time, but that may have been because I was experimenting a bit. All this happened on Medium - so I switched to Hard and reproduced all of this, except I didn't die against the bog body that time around. G3 wasn't that hard to figure out, but it definitely took longer.
You can't really say that G2 is better because it has its advantages and disadvantages... but I'll not go into that again.
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 Zitat von NatDis
What if he has a Geforce? We can't run G1 or G2 on those right now.
Yes we can.
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What, the latest drivers allow us to run G2 on a GeForce (on Win7)?
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Don't know, but not everybody "needs" Win7.
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---> Moved to Gothic 3 Help Section.
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Adventurer
when one does not like a game( but also a film, a painting,a song) i dont think another can tell him : " you have to like this game because......"
when we speak about things that give us pleasures some causes are explainable because these things are pleasures for us and others not.
for example i like g3 for the landscapes, for the story ( i like very much to free cities from thew orcs) and more.....i dont know..
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I found G3, on hard, with alternate AI, Alternate Balancing, to be almost impossible. Particularly the opening battle.
You can switch back and forth in difficulty and alternative AI, but you cannot switch between normal and Alternative Balancing.
With that, I have made it through the opening battle on Hard, alt AI, alt Balancing. You have to fight them one at a time. I find that it is easier to immediatly run around, outside the walls and look for a spot to leap over the walls. There you will find only a few scouts. Attack the scouts, then move towards the rear of the camp, away from diego, milten and others. Move from the rear back towards the front, only fighting them one at a time. Heal up often. Save the game inbetween each kill. Reload if you die.
It can work, it is VERY HARD. I think it is fun and challenging on medium with Alt AI. Hard is too hard. That is my opinion.
"Don't throw stones at every dog that barks at you" George Silver
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For first time playing G3 I would suggest turning off A/B and Alternate AI,and try playing on easy setting until you get the hang of it.
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