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  1. #21 Reply With Quote
    Dragonslayer Powaz's Avatar
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    It is interesting to see how many people are pro-clouds because of the whole technical side, the convenience it can produce (no "archaic" hardware etc.). What is obfuscated in such a reasoning is the possibility of total control of software and information by the cloud provider. The conclusion we can draw from this is that in no way we should succumb to the temptation of agreeing even with the "real facts", like the comfort or the less expensive prices of games, not to mention the constant argument of the war on piracy (I cannot restrain myself from making a tasteless parallel between this and the war on terrorism, it is precisely the same logic: in the appearance of the concern of safety more and more restrictions are being imposed on us resulting in the suspension of even some of our basic rights), if we agree with this we are already giving too much to the "enemy" and in the end it will mean our defeat - loss of rights in the guise of progress, customer support and so on. We should reject such reasoning altogether.
    Powaz is offline Last edited by Powaz; 06.10.2011 at 17:04.

  2. #22 Reply With Quote
    Knight Commander
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    If people can agree to such bullshit like Steam, EA's EULA, etc, I'm sure they'll have no problem with clouds.
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  3. #23 Reply With Quote
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nisarg View Post
    If people can agree to such bullshit like Steam, EA's EULA, etc, I'm sure they'll have no problem with clouds.
    "But it's all made to make the life of us customers easier. Stop bullshiting me with your theories, we at least can present you with practical facts", they'll say.
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  4. #24 Reply With Quote
    Knight Commander
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    But if I have to find me a new hobby, I'll have to give up my life's aim too!
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  5. #25 Reply With Quote
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nisarg View Post
    But if I have to find me a new hobby, I'll have to give up my life's aim too!
    Programming?
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  6. #26 Reply With Quote
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maladiq View Post
    Looks like it is time to search for a new hobby. Well, as far as I heard, Microsoft is planning a cloud OS, and everything comes with an intention to dominate the gaming market: all games, brand new, under 8 dollars. Or at least that is the rumour.
    I've heard that rumour too, but I can't remember where. Do you have any source for that?
    Anyway, I think that even if cloud gaming is the future, there will be a pretty large period of transition from the current gaming system to the new one. Just like in the case of the Blu-ray technology, which was released 5 years ago and yet very few people use it nowadays. Most of them still use DVDs. I for one have never seen a BLu-ray Disc. So maybe things are not that worrying.
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  7. #27 Reply With Quote
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nisarg View Post
    If people can agree to such bullshit like Steam, EA's EULA, etc, I'm sure they'll have no problem with clouds.
    Screw that. EULAs are void to me, I couldn't care less about what they say. I own what I pay for. I won't get further into details. Let's just say I am an incredible programmer


    .............................

    Indeed, imagine a cloud Windows, tied to your name, to your IP, to your address, maybe even to your personal numeric code on your ID card, having access to all your personal data, traffic, every single piece of digital information you rent... Now imagine this in the form of a tablet you take with you, with gps function and triangulation, being traceable at all times, maybe even designed to work in a sort of symbiosis with your mobile phone, having this way access to every single piece of information about you. Power comes with information.
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  8. #28 Reply With Quote
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maladiq View Post
    Now imagine this in the form of a tablet you take with you, with gps function and triangulation, being traceable at all times, maybe even designed to work in a sort of symbiosis with your mobile phone,
    Yes, now imagine an interstellar spaceship with hyperdrive, wormhole scanners and maybe even a CD player so you can listen to your favourite tunes.
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  9. #29 Reply With Quote
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    Quote Originally Posted by One Stoned Bastard View Post
    Yes, now imagine an interstellar spaceship with hyperdrive, wormhole scanners and maybe even a CD player so you can listen to your favourite tunes.
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  10. #30 Reply With Quote
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    Quote Originally Posted by One Stoned Bastard View Post
    Yes, now imagine an interstellar spaceship with hyperdrive, wormhole scanners and maybe even a CD player so you can listen to your favourite tunes.
    True. You have to imagine such a thing but regarding the post of Maladiq we don't even need to because it's already happening.
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  11. #31 Reply With Quote
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    So what I see is this, the publisher will be the first to be screwed - the bulk of their role is distribution and marketing - distribution will be through a near monopoly cloud provider, thus they will end up marketing - but how? They will have to carry a large burden of advertising if visual discovery of a game in a physical store completely disappears. (Stores are the reason I know about popular games like Fallout 3, Borderlands, Medal of Honor, Call of Duty and so on, but I discovered Gothic at a second hand video game resaler and did all my follow on purchases through the web.)

    But if the publishers begin to die, they will effect developers. This is because publishers tend to front the money to the developer. In effect, the publisher is the risk taker. This will shift risk to the developer, this means shifting fund raising to the developer. Investing in a developer is higher risk, because the risk is spread over very few products. Risk is averaged out between a dozen or more games for a publisher. The publisher is not sweating Game X, because he should have a whole alphabet of games in the pipeline. To invest in PB would be very risky as everything is riding on Risen 2!!

    Then, in the end, the cloud gaming will also introduce a kind of bully effect with the monopoly status of the cloud provider. The cloud provider will have the power to set prices. From this, he will seek to lower the price for the consumer while increasing his percent cut against the publishers & developers!

    The effect of this will be less investment money and less total revenue for the game makers, resulting in lower budget games...

    This could mean more games total, at lower prices - but they will be shoddy products. It will thus contradict the advantage of the cloud - that advantage is no need to upgrade your equipment. If the games do not have the budget to exploit the freedom of the cloud, then the cloud is only a wholesaler!!! The games will not be as good as they would be on other platforms. Interesting.
    "Don't throw stones at every dog that barks at you" George Silver
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  12. #32 Reply With Quote
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    I would also say that the cloud will be a short term advantage to the game makers, increasing total volume of sales. But the longer term the cloud will cut the game makers cut of the proceeds.

    However, if there are multiple cloud gaming providers this bully effect will not be as severe. MS, Steam, Apple, Google, OnLive, and hopefully some Asian and European competitors will each compete with each other for the game makers business by offering them good cuts of the sales and block the bully effect from occurring.
    "Don't throw stones at every dog that barks at you" George Silver
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  13. #33 Reply With Quote
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    What about the future Windows? They say it is going to be strictly cloud. All software, games, movies, music, everything will be on their servers. It is said that this is going to lead to the downfall of hardware manufacturers. One will only need a terminal on their desk.
    For the most recent Elex news, the new Piranha Bytes RPG, visit us at World of Elex!!!
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  14. #34 Reply With Quote
    Metasyntaktische Variable  foobar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maladiq View Post
    What about the future Windows? They say it is going to be strictly cloud. All software, games, movies, music, everything will be on their servers. It is said that this is going to lead to the downfall of hardware manufacturers. One will only need a terminal on their desk.
    Rumours. The only future Windows we know anything about is Win8. And while some strange decisions have been made regarding it, it is still a plain old operating system. In fact, besides the new Metro GUI and ARM support for tablets, not much has changed at all. If you want a cloud OS, see ChromeOS. Not exactly the market cleaner.

    This whole “cloud” stuff is just the umpteenth iteration of the decades old controversial of thin vs. fat clients. One of them is always “the future”, the modern and technological advanced concept where everyone wants to go. After a while, people realise that it still does not solve all problems and even has some of its own. Then the other becomes “the future” for a few years.
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  15. #35 Reply With Quote
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maladiq View Post
    What about the future Windows? They say it is going to be strictly cloud. All software, games, movies, music, everything will be on their servers. It is said that this is going to lead to the downfall of hardware manufacturers. One will only need a terminal on their desk.
    I highly doubt it. As long as there are money in hardware it will exist.
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  16. #36 Reply With Quote
    Deus Maladiq's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by foobar View Post
    Rumours. The only future Windows we know anything about is Win8. And while some strange decisions have been made regarding it, it is still a plain old operating system.
    I hope so.
    Quote Originally Posted by Dino View Post
    I highly doubt it. As long as there are money in hardware it will exist.
    Well, someone has to supply the hardware for the gaming servers, right?

    Anyway, I find this new rage with cloud technology to be extremely worrying. I really don't like the concept of having EVERYTHING remotely stored on a third party's servers, with the possibility of being arbitrarily deprived of one of those goods by Microsoft or another company.
    For the most recent Elex news, the new Piranha Bytes RPG, visit us at World of Elex!!!
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  17. #37 Reply With Quote
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maladiq View Post
    I hope so.
    No need for that. Grab the consumer preview version of Win8 and see for yourself.
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  18. #38 Reply With Quote
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    Clouds are crap. I like my PC like i do the sky, without clouds. Apart from all the property rights and similar issues, I really do not want single player games with network troubles and lag. The response times must be horrendous.
    Das dümmste aller Tiere ist der haarlose Affe,
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    kein anderes Tier ist dumm genug von sich selbst zu glauben es sei intelligent und vernunftbegabt
    wenn es das so klar nicht ist und das praktisch täglich auch wieder aufs neue beweist.

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