Gothic 2 Weapon Damage Help

[Niborius]

Hello everyone.

I have a Gothic 2 question that i hope you can help with.
I am confused on how the damage of the melee weapons works.
I heard that the weapon skill % (1h and 2h) determines the % that you get a critical hit. And that when you get a critical hit, your strength gets together with your weapon damage. (so if your strength is 10, you get 10 more damage)

The part i don't get, is that every weapon does the same amount of damage for me. I tried to kill a sheep (sorry sheep) with a knife that does 5 damage. I had to hit it 2 times to kill it. Later i tried it with an Heavy Branch, that does 10 damage. I had to hit it 2 times too to kill it

ps: I have Gothic 2 Gold

Thanks!

[Onisuzume]

*sigh*
This again..

Formula for a critical hit (Melee)
Weapon Damage + Strength - Opponent's Armour with a minimum of 5 damage.

Fomula for a normal hit (Melee)
(Weapon Damage + Strength - Opponent's Armour - 1) /10 with a minimum of 5 damage.

Formula for a normal hit (Ranged)
Weapon Damage + Dexterity - Opponent's Armour with a minimum of 5 damage.

So your reasoning is wrong.
In case of the dagger:
5+10-0(sheep has no armour)-1(subtotal=14)/10=1,4. This is below the minimum so its raised to 5.
In case of a critical hit it'd be:
5+10-0=15 damage.
For the heavy branch it'd look like this:
10+10-0-1(subtotal=19)/10=1,9. Again this is below the minimum so its raised to 5.
And in case of a critical it'd be 20.

So your strength is *always* added to the weapon's damage.
And yes, this *is* different from Gothic 1.

[Niborius]

Damn, why did they make it so complex? and what's 1) /10 exactly? (i asked it before but i still didn't got it because i suck at mathematics)

Thanks alot btw

edit:
i've read it 10 times now and i finally get it.
Thanks for your help!

[SM_Ile]

I don't want to make a new thread, but what is the formula for g3? It's so long since i played g3 and i don't remember/know how to calculate the damage.

I could start playing g3 again with the hardcore patch :)

[WernerTWC]

I don't want to make a new thread, but what is the formula for g3?

Here:
http://forum.worldofplayers.de/forum/showthread.php?p=4096613&#post4096613

[Der_Jonn]

Here:
http://forum.worldofplayers.de/forum/showthread.php?p=4096613&#post4096613

Those formulas are completely wrong. Armour in G3 works as a relative damage reduction, not an absoulte one like in G1 and 2. So each armour value corresponds to a certain percentage of damage reduction. I don't know the actual formula though, there used to be a thread about that in here a few months ago.

[bergo]

...Formula for a critical hit (Melee)
Weapon Damage + Strength - Opponent's Armour with a minimum of 5 damage.

Fomula for a normal hit (Melee)
(Weapon Damage + Strength - Opponent's Armour - 1) /10 with a minimum of 5 damage.

Formula for a normal hit (Ranged)
Weapon Damage + Dexterity - Opponent's Armour with a minimum of 5 damage.

There is something I can't understand. I have 39 dex, 31% 1h, 10% bow and 15 str. I use Sword (require dex)- 40 damage, and Short bow - 15 damage. To kill a young wolf with bow I need 1 shot, with sword I need 5 hits.

Maybe dex required swords use str for theirs damage?

[Onisuzume]

There is something I can't understand. I have 39 dex, 31% 1h, 10% bow and 15 str. I use Sword (require dex)- 40 damage, and Short bow - 15 damage. To kill a young wolf with bow I need 1 shot, with sword I need 5 hits.

Maybe dex required swords use str for theirs damage?
They do...
There's no different formula for dex-based swords, so they use strength for damage purposes.

So with the bow I'd be:
15+39-0=54. A full 34 above the young wolf's HP.

With the sword, however, it'd be like this:
(40+15-10-1(=44))/10=4,4 rounded up to 5. Or 4 hits (not 5).
With an odd chance (31%) of dealing:
40+15-10=45 damage.

[bergo]

They do...
There's no different formula for dex-based swords, so they use strength for damage purposes.

That make theses swords completely useless:mad: What a pity! I trained my dex only. Have +5 str from belt that's why i need 5 hits not 4.

[Tratos]

Hold on, I remember seing the original threads about the damage formulas. And dex does replace str in the calculations, for dex based weapons.

[Onisuzume]

Hold on, I remember seing the original threads about the damage formulas. And dex does replace str in the calculations, for dex based weapons.
I don't think I remember seeing those.
So if you could find the post.

Still, it'd be faily easy to find out if dex has any influence on it.

[Der_Jonn]

Hold on, I remember seing the original threads about the damage formulas. And dex does replace str in the calculations, for dex based weapons.

Maybe you mixed it up with the damage formula for bows and crossbows?

Dex melee weapons defintely don't use a different formula than normal melee weapons. Otherwise they would be far to powerful and strength characters would be ridiculously underpowered in NotR (and they are already underpowered as is).

Dex weapons are really powerful already. Just look at the master sword: 120 damage +10 one hand for only 60 dex. Of course a dex character won't deal a lot of melee damage in late game, but dex weapons are just supposed to be sidearms anyway. A dex characters main weapon is of course his bow.

[bergo]

Maybe you mixed it up with the damage formula for bows and crossbows?

Dex weapons are really powerful already. Just look at the master sword: 120 damage +10 one hand for only 60 dex. Of course a dex character won't deal a lot of melee damage in late game, but dex weapons are just supposed to be sidearms anyway. A dex characters main weapon is of course his bow.

I use master sword but it do less damage than my miserable short bow. I say that again: dex melee weapons are useless without str.
In The Heights of Power mod it's the same:(

[Der_Jonn]

Okay, let's compare a character with 60 dex and 20 strength (10 bonus strength can easily be gotten through bonuses at that point in the game) wielding the Master Sword (60 dex, 120 damage, 100 range, +10 1H skill) to a character with 60 strength who wields the best available strength weapon, the Pirate's Cutlass (60 strength, 65 damage, 70 range).
The dex character will deal 140 damage while the strength character will only deal 125 damage, while having lower range and missing out on the +10% 1H.

[bergo]

Okay, let's compare a character with 60 dex and 20 strength (10 bonus strength can easily be gotten through bonuses at that point in the game) wielding the Master Sword (60 dex, 120 damage, 100 range, +10 1H skill) to a character with 60 strength who wields the best available strength weapon, the Pirate's Cutlass (60 strength, 65 damage, 70 range).
The dex character will deal 140 damage while the strength character will only deal 125 damage, while having lower range and missing out on the +10% 1H.

Let's compare both variants:
a. 50 lp for dex + 10 str from bonus (belt and etc) = master sword = 140 dam

b. 50 lp for str + 10 str from bonus (belt and etc) = Fine Longsword = 150 dam

PS master sword is best dex based melee weapon if want to do more damage you'll need str based weapon.

[Der_Jonn]

Uh, you're comparing a 60 dex weapon with a 70 strength weapon and even with that unfair comparison, the Master Sword is slightly better since 10 range and +4 1H bonus is usually a bit more valuable than 5 damage.

And depending on the situation, Betty can be stronger than the Master Sword.

[bergo]

Uh, you're comparing a 60 dex weapon with a 70 strength weapon and even with that unfair comparison...
And depending on the situation, Betty can be stronger than the Master Sword.

I don't compare a 60 dex with a 70 str weapon. I compare what you can have for 50 lp that's important in my example. 10 more range is small difference for well timed hit, and 4% skill bonus is nothing.
Betty needs 110 dex so much to be spend, because you'll have not enough lp for str. For more damage can use only bows.
The players which spend his lp for dex and str, 1H and 2h, bow and crossbow at the same time are very, very weak during the game.

[Der_Jonn]

50 LP? Then you're talking vanilla G2, in which case dex weapons are of course pretty much useless.

Also, how can getting to 70 strength cost as much LP as getting to 60 dex?

And yes, I know that by the time you can use Betty, she won't be all that useful anymore. My comment about Betty was just in reply to your PS.

[bergo]

50 LP?....Also, how can getting to 70 strength cost as much LP as getting to 60 dex?....


Let's compare both variants:
a. 50 lp for dex + 10 str from bonus (belt and etc) = master sword = 140 dam

b. 50 lp for str + 10 str from bonus (belt and etc) = Fine Longsword = 150 dam

I also don't remember sametimes