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This is getting way too subjective for my liking. I can imagine that the UI we saw in the screenshots are from a beta version, but other than that, I see little "suckiness" in those screens. The world still looks very nice. The game hasn't come out yet, let's not judge it. Additionally, I fail to see what you think constitutes "true gaming". IMO, true gaming is playing a good game, appreciating it for what it is, recognizing it's successes/failures, and enjoying the titles you love, on the platform of your choice. I enjoy my 360, I have fun playing many of the titles released for it. I also enjoy depth, storyline, and immersion. Is that not true gaming?
Ach Fry, Ich hab dich mehr als der Monde, die Sterne...das...fail.
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Perhaps most of the best RPG games are for the PC. Like Baldurs Gate, fallout, gothic, Kotor series and many more.
But there are many great Console RPGs out. Some of the final fantasy games are very good. Not going to say who as i dont whant to go into that discusion.The fable games is ok, Fable 2 was good but i hoped for a more open world and basicly more gear and stuff.
Mass Effect is one of my RPG favorite games. though i know its superior on the PC it is still a great game. And lets not forgett Fallout 3, one of the best sequals to an realy old series. Even though it has some flaws(repair system, sigh) it is an amazing game. And i am still playing it. It is such a far superior product than the awfull Oblivon game.
But of course games are usualy superior on the PC. But honestly i find Console gaming better because of lots of things.
First of it is extreamly much cheaper. An Xbox 360 costs about 200 Euros in my country. And a PC with equal power costs atleast twice or even the triple. Just the graphic cards for an PC costs as much as a Xbox.
Second are the horrible and annoying protection programs and rules that comes with PC games.. DRM has kept me from buying lots of games the past few years. And i realy dont see the point, people will always be able to crack a game. Just an unnecesary cost in game development.
And Third it is more convenient, relaxing and accesible to the public. Not everyone actualy knows how to even install a game.
The thing i hope comes with the next generation of consolles is the same community access with game. Like mods and such. game editors and all that.
Well enough of my ranting, im extreamly happy about Arcania comming to the Xbox 360. This is just great news. And i am actualy starting to think it can be a good game. They seem serious to get the old feel of the game back and lets just hope JoWood lets Spellbound finish the game and not make the same mistake again.
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Just to clarify:
Zitat von mistress_larisa
Although that interview it's apparently with Xaver Bayer, not Michael Paeck.
You must improve your german a bit more.
The description of what is in that podcast could be read like this:
- Mit dabei sind Interviews mit dem Produzenten von Gothic 3
- und Autor Xaver Bayer,
- eine Vorschau auf das Wii Event in London, die X06 und die Tokyo Game Show uvm.
(One interview with the Producer of g3 (Michael Paeck) and one interview with an author of a book (Xaver Bayer), both in the same podcast).
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Zitat von WernerTWC
You must improve your german a bit more.
[Bild: igitt.gif] Not in this lifetime.
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True gaming is just an expression of mine that I mostly use.I mean the gaming in the older times.Before consoles like XBOX 360 were released in the old times the spirit of gaming was different.The games were not as repeatable and boring as they were now in anything. I was always so excited when I was playing them that I couldn't leave from the monitor.And the genres were true to their titles unlike now.For example rpgs do not deserve to be called like that now.In older times rp gaming was more like compatible to its name and much more hardcore challenge.Also the atmosphere and the gameworld was too intresting that I could explore the gameworld for ages.All those things do not exist now.After XBOX 360 was released everything changed.The rp gaming especially has a lot of crisis.The gameworld is totally unintresting,the gameplay like quests too repeatable and the combat systems too bad.And this is simply because they are released on consoles to impress american children.But since americans have a lot of money companies make it like that to take the money from them.That is the crisis of gaming.Ok,I could have said more I just don't have time now.Got to sleep because I have exams tommorow.So good night.
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The only problem with console gaming I see is the different target audience. It would be probably a not very wise decision to make a M-rated game (18 or older) for 360. So some mature features may not be present. I am 31, and for me The Witcher is exactly the right kind of a game, and I percieve Fable series as being kind of childish.
If there will be a dog in Arcania, I prefer to choose a breed.
SKEPTICISM IS A VIRTUE!
Лидия: Любимый, я беременна!
Я: ФУС-РО-ДА!!!!
Geändert von vivaxardas (20.05.2009 um 06:47 Uhr)
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Ach Fry, Ich hab dich mehr als der Monde, die Sterne...das...fail.
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Zitat von vivaxardas
The only problem with console gaming I see is the different target audience. It would be probably a not very wise decision to make a M-rated game (18 or older) for 360.
GTA did quite well.
Meh, before starting to qualify people as "true gamers" and "not so true gamers", I would like to announce that anyone who does not know how to code a binary search tree in some form does not qualify as a "true computar user"
Thank you.
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Zitat von jimokalos
The games were not as repeatable and boring as they were now in anything.
Oh well, it's proven: Jim hasn't played old games. He is viewing this through rose-tinted glasses. Anything and everything he says about old games is pretty much made void by this.
Repetition was a keyword in basically all old games, regardless of genre. Level after level after level of basically the very same formula with just a bit more difficult foes and tougher levels, but the basic idea was the same for all of the 10-100 levels (or their equivalent) a game would have.
I speak of experience. I've been playing computer games since, oh, about 1986 when I first played Pac-Man on a friends' older sisters' C64, and I've been playing computer games ever since. I know what I'm talking about, I was there.
Zitat von jimokalos
Dude,for heavens sake.I don't know what to say anymore. Ah,forget it,pherhaps I was wrong for you after all.Come on mate,you can't be serious with this can you?
What did I say to you about your attitude, kid? I'm not having a good morning, and you're not making it any better. Improve your attitude NOW, stop acting like you've got any reason to be authoritative or condescending, because quite frankly, you have absolutely none.
We expect the posters to be able to treat each other civilly, politely and friendly. This is a prime example of behaviour that is not such. And it ain't the first time we have to say to you about it. I hope it's the last, though.
Geändert von Hellbilly (20.05.2009 um 06:52 Uhr)
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I don't really understand how could consoles affect the atmosphere and storywriting in a game. A platform's juristiction only goes as far as the technical side. There may be a tendency to dumb down games on consoles, but that's no reason to lump all console games together. There's nothing preventing a good game from being released on consoles, in fact that happens all the time.
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Zitat von Korianous
What is with your perception of Americans? Where are you getting this crap from? You realize that I am an American, and I couldn't fit less with the stereotype you have just made up.
No,you love XBOX 360.You said it yourself.That is what I am saying.
Zitat von Hellbilly
Oh well, it's proven: Jim hasn't played old games. He is viewing this through rose-tinted glasses. Anything and everything he says about old games is pretty much made void by this.
Dude,if you Pac man or any other arcade game,I have played a lot.And I don't mean them,I acutally mean pre-XBOX 360 times if you can't understand me that way,ok???
Zitat von Hellbilly
What did I say to you about your attitude, kid? I'm not having a good morning, and you're not making it any better. Improve your attitude NOW, stop acting like you've got any reason to be authoritative or condescending, because quite frankly, you have absolutely none.
We expect the posters to be able to treat each other civilly, politely and friendly. This is a prime example of behaviour that is not such. And it ain't the first time we have to say to you about it. I hope it's the last, though.
Well neither my morning is good you know.I have a headcache and I have exams.For that I am stopping all this right now.
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Zitat von jimokalos
I acutally mean pre-XBOX 360 times if you can't understand me that way,ok???
So do I. From arcade games to C64 to NES to SNES and Sega Megadrive to Playstation to X-Box. Been there, done that, worn the t-shirt and yes, repetition is the keyword.
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Zitat von Bastardo
Didn't notice the talk was about Windows games.
And even then I think you can track the start of gaming on Windows without DOS support around year '95? When DirectX 1.0 and Win 95 were released.
'95 supports DOS ya know...
As does '98.
Now they are just 'somehow' RPGs?
And not all modern RPGs are easy to beat. The first game that comes to mind when I think of very good RPGs from the 'modern age': The Witcher.
Heh, try icewind dale. *That* is a tough rpg, even on easy mode. I had to revive 3 characters already and I've only reached the 2nd town. Then again, my party is only 3 instead of the usual 6. I've also decided to try it with a single character.
All I see is "sucker oblivion", "repeatable [sic] gameplay", "brought the rp gaming to a dead end", "released in [sic] XBOX 360", "low requirements", "good grafics [sic]", "Americans loved it", etc.
I see no argument in favor of your statement that console games can never be as good as PC games.
There's plenty of good and valid reasons *why* oblivion sucks, just do a search.
Thanks for posting a link to 360 site. I am glad that Arcania will be published for 360 - no need to upgrade my comp.
BTW, it is said that it will be released on Fall 2009. Is it correct?
I'll get the pipes and the drums.
Come on, we both know November 11 is the kill line for the Xmas market.
And why would that be?
Oblivion, albeit a rather dumbed-down game, had an enormously open-ended world, and the amount of playing time you can get out of it is near-infinite. And no, you are not invincible from the beginning, especially on a high difficulty level. It had its flaws, namely the scaled leveling system, the very limited dialogue and interactiveness of NPCs, which as I've said before, abuses suspension of disbelief ridiculously.
Near-infinite playing time? With dungeons which all look alike and aren't worth the effort to explore?
And I would say that this statement is wholly, utterly wrong. Americans loved the old Fallout, Ultima Series, and other great RPGs. This stereotype is ridiculous, and wholly unfounded. I would go so far as to say you do not know what true gaming means, if you think console gaming isn't "true" gaming.
Do I have to remind you that those games were released for PC only?
And lets not forgett Fallout 3, one of the best sequals to an realy old series. Even though it has some flaws(repair system, sigh) it is an amazing game. And i am still playing it. It is such a far superior product than the awfull Oblivon game.
Sacrilege! Fallout 3 isn't even worthy of the name.
Second are the horrible and annoying protection programs and rules that comes with PC games.. DRM has kept me from buying lots of games the past few years. And i realy dont see the point, people will always be able to crack a game. Just an unnecesary cost in game development.
Same goes for console games.
Ever hear of emulators? If I had a euro for every rom'd console game, why, I'd be dead and robbed ten times over. Xox360 emulator? None yet, because PCs aren't strong enough to handle it yet (emulators typically require 2-3 times the power of the console they try to emulate). So theoretically, it can be done. Ditto for the Wii.
And Third it is more convenient, relaxing and accesible to the public. Not everyone actualy knows how to even install a game.
And not everyone can hook it up to a TV either. With me being a prime example. (My tv does *not* have a scart)
Repetition was a keyword in basically all old games, regardless of genre. Level after level after level of basically the very same formula with just a bit more difficult foes and tougher levels, but the basic idea was the same for all of the 10-100 levels (or their equivalent) a game would have.
And that is exactly the problem I have with most games. Especially console games. From all the console games that I've played with friends (at their place), almost all were repetitive, button-mashing, or both.
Most PC FPS games are also subject to this. As are strategy games...
I don't really understand how could consoles affect the atmosphere and storywriting in a game.
The target audiance, obviously. If the people who you're trying to sell the game to has no interrest in deep storylines where they have to read a lot to follow it, it isn't going to sell. And as such, it won't be made that way.
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Exactly,thanx for posting the reasons Oni because I was boring.
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Zitat von Onisuzume
And that is exactly the problem I have with most games. Especially console games.
Makes no difference what platform they are released on, repetition is a standard element in almost all games. Genre and platform are irrelevant. In fact, y'all take off your pink lovey dovey shades for a while and smell the coffee: even Gothic is basically a very repetitive game. Talk to character A, trigger trigger B, go to place C, get item D or kill monster E, return to character A, rinse, repeat. All quests are based on one or two archetypes with only minor variations to them. It's repetition, that can't be denied. It's just a matter of whether you enjoy doing that particular thing over and over again.
Also, the majority of all PC games are just as much button-mashing as console games. It's not consoles that are the problem, it's the games. And the games have been this way since way before consoles were a medium people played games upon. Nothing has changed in this respect, and consoles have made it neither better nor worse. Only people who either have no knowledge of old games, or who are so desperate to bash consoles it's just daft, deny this.
As Oni mentioned: strategy games. A good case in point, real-time strategies, a genre of gaming that for the most part has remained the "property" of PC gamers despite a few of them making appearances on consoles. They're the apex of repetition: build base, build troops, attack. Next level: build bigger base, more troops, attack. Next level: base, even bigger army, attack. And when virtually all games follow this pattern... well, that's a schoolbook example of repetition ad nauseum.
Geändert von Hellbilly (20.05.2009 um 11:00 Uhr)
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Zitat von Onisuzume
'95 supports DOS ya know...
As does '98.
Thanks, but I knew that. I probably spent most of my childhood on Windows 95 & 98. My point is that in 95 developers started using Windows as a platform, with the release of DirecX 1.0. Check again the context of my post if you don't get what I mean.
The target audiance, obviously. If the people who you're trying to sell the game to has no interrest in deep storylines where they have to read a lot to follow it, it isn't going to sell. And as such, it won't be made that way.
But that's necessarily the case with all console games, and it's not the console's fault, the console is just a piece of crap that spins discs, leave the poh console alone.
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Zitat von Hellbilly
Makes no difference what platform they are released on, repetition is a standard element in almost all games. Genre and platform are irrelevant. In fact, y'all take off your pink lovey dovey shades for a while and smell the coffee: even Gothic is basically a very repetitive game. Talk to character A, trigger trigger B, go to place C, get item D or kill monster E, return to character A, rinse, repeat. All quests are based on one or two archetypes with only minor variations to them. It's repetition, that can't be denied. It's just a matter of whether you enjoy doing that particular thing over and over again.
Totally wrong,in quests for example gothic 1 and 2 are not too repeatable.It's not like go and bring me some food and other bullshit like in mmos or console rpgs.You do a lot of great things,investigating,exploring a lot of mystery etc.This is a true adventure,not the: GO and bring me 6 pieces of bread,some meat etc.The developers do not want to make it as crappy as it would be in the mmos or console games,but money is their first target unfortunately.
Zitat von Hellbilly
Also, the majority of all PC games are just as much button-mashing as console games. It's not consoles that are the problem, it's the games. And the games have been this way since way before consoles were a medium people played games upon. Nothing has changed in this respect, and consoles have made it neither better nor worse. Only people who either have no knowledge of old games, or who are so desperate to bash consoles it's just daft, deny this.
Totally wrong,there is huge different in an rpg of 2008 and an rpg of 2001.A genre like rpgs can never be compatible to consoles unless they make it as simple and repeatable as the consoles require.This way it can be released on consoles but still what remains from it is a piece of crap.
Zitat von Hellbilly
As Oni mentioned: strategy games. A good case in point, real-time strategies, a genre of gaming that for the most part has remained the "property" of PC gamers despite a few of them making appearances on consoles. They're the apex of repetition: build base, build troops, attack. Next level: build bigger base, more troops, attack. Next level: base, even bigger army, attack. And when virtually all games follow this pattern... well, that's a schoolbook example of repetition ad nauseum.
Strategies are not the same as rpgs,strategies are and will always be the same.They can even become greatly multiplayer in that case.Whatever they do to them they will always be like that.They are not like the rpgs.
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Zitat von jimokalos
Totally wrong,in quests for example gothic 1 and 2 are not too repeatable.It's not like go and bring me some food and other bullshit like in mmos or console rpgs.You do a lot of great things,investigating,exploring a lot of mystery etc.This is a true adventure,not the: GO and bring me 6 pieces of bread,some meat etc.The developers do not want to make it as crappy as it would be in the mmos or console games,but money is their first target unfortunately.
Like I said, take of your pink lovey dovey goggles and smell the coffee.
Zitat von jimokalos
Totally wrong,there is huge different in an rpg of 2008 and an rpg of 2001.A genre like rpgs can never be compatible to consoles unless they make it as simple and repeatable as the consoles require.This way it can be released on consoles but still what remains from it is a piece of crap.
There have been good RPG's on consoles, and there will be. But then again, I wouldn't expect someone as biased as you to accept that ever.
Zitat von jimokalos
strategies are and will always be the same.
Ha.
Wrong.
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Zitat von Hellbilly
Like I said, take of your pink lovey dovey goggles and smell the coffee.
????
Zitat von Hellbilly
There have been good RPG's on consoles, and there will be. But then again, I wouldn't expect someone as biased as you to accept that ever.
As I said,the problem is with the newest consoles not with the older ones.Just tell me one good rpg then that has been released first on XBOX 360 and then on pc and it is good then. Tell me then since you seem to know rpgs better than me that I have played nearly every rpg that has been released in history. BTW,right now I am playing Drakensang,a game that hasn't been released on XBOX 360 and it is so AWESOME.
Zitat von Hellbilly
Ha.
Wrong.
Yes,the only non repeatable strategy games that I have played are Age of empires 1 and 2,Age of mythology,warcraft,lords of the realm and some others.
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Zitat von jimokalos
me that I have played nearly every rpg that has been released in history.
Oh, that's nonsense and you know it. I'm certain that the original classics of genre are a field you've barely even touched. And read my, Bastardos' and Korianous' posts to see why everything else in your post is is, as they say, moot.
Zitat von jimokalos
Yes,the only non repeatable strategy games that I have played are Age of empires 1 and 2,Age of mythology,warcraft,lords of the realm and some others.
Yeah well, then you obviously haven't played some of the cornerstones of the genre. Strategy, and I mean real strategy, is in many ways one of the least repetitive genres in gaming.
And heck, most of those are just RTS's as well.
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